SAA to start job cuts?

Discussions pertaining to Airline operations,safety and training for Flight Deck Crew. Open to anyone who would like to learn all aspects of the Airline industry from a pilots perspective.

Moderator: Moderators

User avatar
Richard Smit
Too Tousand
Too Tousand
Posts: 2942
Joined: Thu Apr 06, 2006 5:02 pm
Closest Airfield: Stilbaai
Location: RSA, Stilbaai
Has liked: 4 times
Been liked: 64 times

Re: SAA to start job cuts?

Unread post by Richard Smit » Tue Nov 26, 2019 12:16 pm

Okay Snoopy.

We get it.
These users liked the author Richard Smit for the post (total 2):
MadMacsEDP
Spool-Up
Areaman
Preflighting
Posts: 24
Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 7:19 am
Closest Airfield: FAOR
Location: FAOR
Has liked: 1 time
Been liked: 6 times

Re: SAA to start job cuts?

Unread post by Areaman » Tue Nov 26, 2019 12:29 pm

snoopy wrote:
Tue Nov 26, 2019 10:35 am
I read that tax payers who contributed to SAA bailouts for years; now pensioners; are going on strike tomorrow demanding a state pension of R12000 per month, or they want their tax money wasted on SAA back, with back pay since the 1st day they started paying tax to the state.... :twisted:
👏👏👏👏👏👏👏, Hit the nail on the head....Stop
Waisting tax PAYERS money ....bus rescue!
It is also absolutely crazy in the midst of all this....
Flying around in leased 350s...the mind boggles.
User avatar
GL
Niner Tousand
Niner Tousand
Posts: 9270
Joined: Fri Sep 23, 2005 10:08 am
Closest Airfield: FACT
Location: Lost for words
Has liked: 49 times
Been liked: 120 times

Re: SAA to start job cuts?

Unread post by GL » Wed Nov 27, 2019 6:12 pm

I wonder what Gordhan's agenda is in issuing this statement?
MEDIA STATEMENT
 
UPDATE ON SOUTH AFRICAN AIRWAYS
 
The strike at South African Airways SOC Limited (SAA) with consequential cancellation of bookings has resulted in a sudden deterioration of SAA’s financial position.
Accordingly, the Department of Public Enterprises is working together with SAA to urgently formulate immediate actions that will be required to provide support to enable SAA to carry on its business. However, SAA cannot continue “as is”.

Government efforts, under the direction of Minister of Public Enterprises, Mr. Pravin Gordhan, are focused on ensuring that:
- The airline is stabilized in the short term and has the necessary support from all stakeholders ;
- Governance and leadership issues are being addressed including the process of appointing an effective Management Team; and
- The airline returns to a stronger financial footing in the medium to longer term.

None of this can be achieved without the necessary contributions by all the key role players in the airline.

The actions being undertaken by the Minister include involving relevant stakeholders so that they can participate in the support initiative.

Further details will be provided over the next week.
Our body is made to move, and our mind is made to connect with other people.
– Sjur Nesheim, Norwegian mountaineer

The essentials to happiness:
• someone to love,
• something to do,
• something to hope for

Guy Leitch
User avatar
Induna
1k poster
1k poster
Posts: 1244
Joined: Tue Mar 20, 2012 10:01 am
Closest Airfield: FASD
Location: Port Owen - Western Cape
Has liked: 39 times
Been liked: 33 times

Re: SAA to start job cuts?

Unread post by Induna » Wed Nov 27, 2019 8:03 pm

GL wrote:
Wed Nov 27, 2019 6:12 pm
I wonder what Gordhan's agenda is in issuing this statement?
MEDIA STATEMENT
 
UPDATE ON SOUTH AFRICAN AIRWAYS
 
The strike at South African Airways SOC Limited (SAA) with consequential cancellation of bookings has resulted in a sudden deterioration of SAA’s financial position.
Accordingly, the Department of Public Enterprises is working together with SAA to urgently formulate immediate actions that will be required to provide support to enable SAA to carry on its business. However, SAA cannot continue “as is”.

Government efforts, under the direction of Minister of Public Enterprises, Mr. Pravin Gordhan, are focused on ensuring that:
- The airline is stabilized in the short term and has the necessary support from all stakeholders ;
- Governance and leadership issues are being addressed including the process of appointing an effective Management Team; and
- The airline returns to a stronger financial footing in the medium to longer term.

None of this can be achieved without the necessary contributions by all the key role players in the airline.

The actions being undertaken by the Minister include involving relevant stakeholders so that they can participate in the support initiative.

Further details will be provided over the next week.
Maybe he is planning a “reshuffle” of management and the board (if he has the powers) or maybe he really has a strategy outside of government (equity partner) and use this situation as ammunition... :?:
Jacques van der Westhuizen
ZS-WSW | Sonerai 2L
User avatar
Caravan Driver
Changing Underwear
Posts: 543
Joined: Sat Oct 07, 2006 2:41 pm
Location: FALA
Has liked: 0
Been liked: 3 times

Re: SAA to start job cuts?

Unread post by Caravan Driver » Wed Nov 27, 2019 9:37 pm

The department will provide the required funding by the end of this week to pay salaries and to support the short term financial needs of the airline although they are not in a legal position to provide any funding this year still. It is an emergency.
"Pilots are a rare kind of human being... They take to the skies to purify their souls and only return to earth once they have received the communion of the infinite!"
User avatar
Ugly Duckling
Six Tousand
Six Tousand
Posts: 6466
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2006 2:24 pm
Closest Airfield: Brakpan Benoni FABB
Location: Waterkloof
Has liked: 402 times
Been liked: 309 times

Re: SAA to start job cuts?

Unread post by Ugly Duckling » Wed Nov 27, 2019 10:25 pm

I believe that the loss in revenue during the strike amounts to R52 million per day.
Paul Sabatier EAA Ch 575, SSSA, ERGC, ERFC, AeroClub
Long time Cygnet builder
The object is to fly, it does not matter what the object is!
User avatar
ARM505
Last nights Garlic 'repeats' itself.
Posts: 378
Joined: Mon May 12, 2008 10:33 pm
Has liked: 1 time
Been liked: 9 times

Re: SAA to start job cuts?

Unread post by ARM505 » Thu Nov 28, 2019 8:05 am

https://www.businesslive.co.za/bd/natio ... aign=daily

So, here's how it's going to go, I guess. They will a) get the money, in which case this exact scenario (where they cease trading) will simply play out sometime in the future, and the taxpayers will have wasted another 2 Billion+ (pffft, small change!), or b) they cease trading now. This company is not recoverable. It cannot survive in it's present form. This has been reasonably clear for the past decade at the very least.

So, it's now.......or later.

MINIMUMS...Decide.
User avatar
Deanw
Six Tousand
Six Tousand
Posts: 6536
Joined: Wed Jan 28, 2004 1:37 pm
Closest Airfield: FACT
Has liked: 10 times
Been liked: 104 times

Re: SAA to start job cuts?

Unread post by Deanw » Thu Nov 28, 2019 1:07 pm

There is a battle behind the scenes between Public Enterprises and Treasury. One wants more money, the other doesn't want to give ...
How come every time my ship comes in I'm at the airport?

http://www.SAairforce.co.za
User avatar
paulw
Fower Tousand
Fower Tousand
Posts: 4491
Joined: Mon Apr 18, 2011 3:48 pm
Closest Airfield: Galway Airport
Location: Galway
Has liked: 34 times
Been liked: 31 times

Re: SAA to start job cuts?

Unread post by paulw » Thu Nov 28, 2019 8:03 pm

Deanw wrote:
Thu Nov 28, 2019 1:07 pm
There is a battle behind the scenes between Public Enterprises and Treasury. One wants more money, the other doesn't want to give ...
....or don't have to give....or which Government department will have to sacrifice some of their budget?
.
Don't believe what I post, research what I post....
They have a book on how to take my money away? When did this happen......
gregdeklerk
Rolling
Posts: 171
Joined: Thu Mar 13, 2014 4:59 pm
Closest Airfield: FACT
Location: Cape Town
Has liked: 5 times
Been liked: 3 times

Re: SAA to start job cuts?

Unread post by gregdeklerk » Fri Nov 29, 2019 7:36 am

I think the recent spate of unfortunate events at SAA is the begining of the end in its present form. Perhaps I am wrong. SCOPA has had enough as well.

I wonder if the A350s will ever do revenue flights.
User avatar
jbayfan
Take off Clearance
Posts: 126
Joined: Mon Feb 06, 2012 11:09 am
Has liked: 2 times
Been liked: 26 times

Re: SAA to start job cuts?

Unread post by jbayfan » Fri Nov 29, 2019 10:04 pm

snoopy wrote:
Mon Nov 25, 2019 6:50 pm
The way I understood it is that SAA retrenchment has been set aside till next year, just a few weeks away.

But tell me this - how is the responsibility (same work same pay) of Mango pilots deemed of any less value than that of SAA pilots? They do exactly the same work. And both airlines are 100% owned by SAA. And SAA is being bailed out by our tax money every year...for years on end.

And who flew all the extra Mango flights; to make up for the flights lost by SAA; due to their cabin crew strike wanting more money ?

Mango pilots or SAA pilots and cabin crew? At what pay? SAA pay rates or Mango pay rates?

Maybe they should do a pilot and cabin crew swap for the same pay as Mango pilots and cabin crew for a few months? Maybe that will drive a nail home for SAA, of just how good they actually have it on our tax money? Because any increase approved for SAA isnt as a result of their BETTER performance. Its just as result of union coercion on a tax payer funded airline.
You have no clue. Obviously not an airline pilot or, if you are, you certainly don't value your profession
These users liked the author jbayfan for the post:
EDP
C152, C172, C182, C210, PA28, PA30, PA34, 7ECA, R2160i, AC11, BE55, BE58, BE90, BE20, B190, BE99, C501, DC3, DHC6, B732, B733, B734, B744, A319, A320, A332, A333, A342, A343, A346, R44, UH1H
ZX357
Aircraft in Hangar
Posts: 14
Joined: Mon May 20, 2019 10:46 am
Closest Airfield: OR Tambo
Location: Johannesburg
Has liked: 0
Been liked: 0

Re: SAA to start job cuts?

Unread post by ZX357 » Sun Dec 01, 2019 1:04 pm

User avatar
Ugly Duckling
Six Tousand
Six Tousand
Posts: 6466
Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2006 2:24 pm
Closest Airfield: Brakpan Benoni FABB
Location: Waterkloof
Has liked: 402 times
Been liked: 309 times

Re: SAA to start job cuts?

Unread post by Ugly Duckling » Sun Dec 01, 2019 7:12 pm

https://m.fin24.com/Companies/Industria ... s-20191201
SAA enters danger zone as companies start withdrawing business
11:48 01/12/2019 Michael Cohen and Paul Vecchiatto, Bloomberg News

Speculation that South African Airways is in danger of going under could become self-fulfilling.

The national carrier has been given R57bn in bailouts since 1994 and last made a profit in 2011. Its already precarious finances took another hit last month when workers staged a week-long strike that grounded a number of flights, and customers have canceled bookings on others.


The extent of the carrier’s cash crisis was on stark display when it missed a deadline to publish its financial statements, due at the end of October, and delayed paying workers’ their full salaries for November.

While Public Enterprises Minister Pravin Gordhan has said he’s working on a plan to enable SAA to continue operating and become viable - further details will be released this week - Finance Minister Tito Mboweni has said it would be better if the airline was shut down.

‘Financial abyss’

“SAA is now looking over the edge of a financial abyss,” said Raymond Parsons, a professor at North West University’s Business School in Potchefstroom.

“Its balance-sheet viability game is now very much in injury time. Tough strategic decisions need to be urgently implemented to put it on a sustainable footing and to regain the confidence of customers and other stakeholder."

Companies are losing faith that the airline can and will be saved. On November 28, Sanlam’s Travel Insurance Consultants unit said it will exclude SAA from its insolvency cover. That announcement and the government’s mixed messages about bailing out the airline again prompted Flight Centre Travel Group, one of South Africa’s biggest travel companies, to stop selling the state airline’s tickets.

“We have had to make an immediate move to mitigate the risk to ourselves and our clients,” said Andrew Stark, Flight Centre’s managing director for Middle East and Africa.

The biggest and most immediate impact of the loss of insurance cover and travel agency bookings will be on SAA’s domestic business-travel revenue, according to Joachim Vermooten, an independent airline economist.

The effect on its international business will take longer to determine, because the bulk of passengers on those flights are tourists, he said. Many of them book tickets well in advance, and it’s too early to say whether the airline can survive, Vermooten said.

SAA, which offers flights to more than 30 local and international destinations, began operating in 1934 when the government took over the assets and liabilities of Union Airways. The government sold a 20% stake in the carrier to Swissair in 1999 and bought the shares back in 2002 after the Swiss carrier went bankrupt. While the government has said it will consider selling an equity stake, no tangible progress has been evident.

Parliament’s tourism committee said in a statement the carrier must keep flying and called on President Cyril Ramaphosa to intervene and restore it to financial stability. Even if the government were to intervene, it would struggle to come up with the money at a time when its own finances are under pressure, the economy is stagnating and it’s facing calls from other state companies for bailouts.

Hard line

SAA spokesperson Tlali Tlali, Gordhan’s spokesperson, Sam Mkokeli, and Mboweni’s spokeswoman, Mashudu Masutha-Rammutle, didn’t answer calls to their mobile phones seeking comment.

Alf Lees, finance spokesperson for the Democratic Alliance, urged the government to take a hard line.

“If government gives it more money, SAA will simply continue with its bad business practices and then will end up in the same situation again in the near future,” he said.
Paul Sabatier EAA Ch 575, SSSA, ERGC, ERFC, AeroClub
Long time Cygnet builder
The object is to fly, it does not matter what the object is!
User avatar
snoopy
Frequent AvComer
Posts: 669
Joined: Sun Aug 12, 2018 4:02 pm
Closest Airfield: FASH
Has liked: 75 times
Been liked: 94 times

Re: SAA to start job cuts?

Unread post by snoopy » Mon Dec 02, 2019 9:39 am

Just like ESKOM; government ( "oversight" of SAA - actually the SA taxpayer is the owner) believes restructuring the airline can ENSURE its financial (1) and operational (2) sustainability? This hasn't worked for ESKOM.

Heraclitus — 'The Only Thing That Is Constant Is Change' And if it wants to survive in ANY future shape - it will have to prove that it isn't going to drag private tourism business outside of SAA down the toilet with it; because of its own internal issues, mismanagement and wasteful spending. If SAA want to manage themselves into oblivion - they should be allowed to do it by themselves...without it damaging the rest of SA's private business.

SAA's purse, is the SA taxpayer...its purse has options. That can steer the future of this problem onto the course it should go. So that the SA tax payers dont have to deal with this problem ever again. Just like many have done with the problem of an unsustainable power utility in SA.

There is no doubt in my mind - that if there is a demand for profitable routes SAA flies - That the competent (ex SAA) aircrews and cabin crew will find employment in other private airlines that will take up these routes if SAA folds. And the "excessive corporate fat" will be cut away once and for all.

Just 3 months ago this article featured in main news...

Consolidating SAA, Mango and struggling SA Express comes as a R300m bailout is approved for the latter
11 SEPTEMBER 2019 - 12:50 by LINDA ENSOR BusinessDay

Now this....

SAA to undergo ‘radical restructuring’: Gordhan
01 December 2019
https://www.timeslive.co.za/news/south- ... g-gordhan/
Vivere come se mai dovessimo morire
Romeo E.T.
8000 Tousand
8000 Tousand
Posts: 8874
Joined: Wed Nov 16, 2005 10:49 pm
Closest Airfield: FAJS
Location: JHB INTL/Kpt Park/Rand Apt
Has liked: 24 times
Been liked: 137 times

Re: SAA to start job cuts?

Unread post by Romeo E.T. » Mon Dec 02, 2019 10:46 pm

Image
sometimes we suffer a bit from C.R.A.F.T. sickness..Can't Remember A F@#%ing Thing

https://www.facebook.com/ralf.t.schulz

Return to “Airline Chatter”